I think Marshall and Mary might end up more than friends. What do you think?

I sure hope so ... so does 61% of the population that has voted on the IN PLAIN SIGHT POLL Who makes the best couple?

Uh, duh. In Marshall's bio it says they're friends, partners, and maybe someday more, if that's not foreshadowing to what this ENTIRE series is going to lead up to I don't know what is.

I think that it might lead to something else. but for now, they're just friends and partners.
or, that they like each other, but can never be together...

I thought they look cute together

check out youtube.

type in "marshall's relationships"

Goobers?!! Stan's a goober?! BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Considering Mary is going to get engaged to Raph this season, I wouldn't hold out much hope for Mary and Marshall. They're colleagues, that's all.

Engaged doesn't mean married, much less the whole fussy business. I can't imagine Mary doing anything approaching that.

Where did you find that? I couldn't find it anywhere!

Marshall already has feeling for Mary, he just tries to keep it hidden from everyone. It comes out when she's hurting and he makes an effort to comfort her. I believe that she has deeper feelings for him than even she knows because when things get to be too much, she will confide in him when she won't talk to anyone else.

A love scene between them would be so AWESOME! Even if it is nothing but a dream . COME ON ALREADY!!

Count me in the "I hope not" camp.

The show will go to the dogs as soon as that happens.

I'm in that camp too. I have read on here that Fred says in interviews that Marshal has feelings for Mary, but I just don't see it. I have seen him look at her with the awareness that she is, in fact a woman...such as when "the girls" were in his face in Never the Bride. But then, as he told Mary when she accused him of being ready to "throw it down with his partner" with armed killers around the corner..."I'm a guy. That's what we do." But that is lust, not romantic feelings. More often his comment, "You're no girl" is how I think he sees her. I like their partnership/friendship...I would not like a romance between them, I don't think.

But then, I just have this weird aversion to portraying law enforcement officers as being romantically involved. While there are TV shows I "ship"...I rarely, if ever, ship cop shows. That's the one thing I dislike about Saving Grace.

I am with you on this point. I generally don't like these shows with "relationships" amongst partners. The point about Saving Grace and the relationship with Ham and Grace is great. I can't stand this relationship and wish they would just end it somehow. I do love Saving Grace otherwise. Grace is such a compelling character, she is so screwed up that I can't stop watching her, just like a car wreck on the freeway to me.

I guess the one good thing about the Grace and Ham relationship is that it demonstrates the pitfalls of law enforcement partners becoming romantically involved. You are right, Grace is a compelling character. And it looks like she's probably been with just about everyone in the department. But Ham is different, it's becoming serious...more for him than for her. And there's the problem. Ham is more invested in this relationship than Grace is and he is beginning to have a real problem with that. I missed last week's episode, so I don't know what happened between them, but the way it's going this is going to spill over into their work and it won't be pretty.

OK, OK...I'll get back on topic. This is exactly my bias against these kind of relationships. It doesn't bother me on other types of shows; medical, lawyer, whatever. Workplace romances can get sticky and make things at work difficult. But with law enforcement, partners need to be able to trust one another with their lives. They also need to be completely focused on the job while they are working or someone could get killed. So Stan and Eleanor...I'm all for that. Stan and Eleanor aren't likely to get caught in a shoot-out that neither of them saw coming because they were distracted by whatever problems they may be having. Mary and Marshal, on the other hand, are much more likely to get into a shootout....and I want them both to be focused on the danger at hand, not on how soon can they get home and jump into bed. And I see nothing but problems if they were to get together. Just like Grace and Ham on Saving Grace, I think Marshal would likely be more invested in any relationship than Mary would.

I'm not against the idea at all, which is weird to me since I generally don't "ship" characters.

I think if they go in that direction it will all depend on how it plays out. I've seen it work out really well on some shows, other shows, not so much.

All the same, I don't think anything serious will happen between them any time soon. They've really been keeping how Marshall feels about Mary on the back burner, so I don't think it will suddenly become a big storyline. But I'm just willing to wait and see how it turns out. The relationship between Mary and Marshall is my favorite aspect of the show and I've been happy so far, so I'm just gonna sit back and see where the writers take us.

Interesting.

I thought it was pretty clear that he DOES have feelings for Mary. He disguises them with pointed banter, like "You're no girl" and (my favorite so far) "Actually I was going to say 'Taming of the Shrew'".

I've never seen "Grace", but I am a Holly Hunter fan. It's just that I'm not too much for straight-out police dramas. I think she is an impressive actress and I love the way she immerses herself in whatever character she portrays. BUT, I'm of the no-shipping mindset. For one: is there any bigger cliché out there? Just because it is a male-female pair, there HAS TO BE romance involved? Somehow I feel that writers are lowering their standards, pandering when they start writing in that direction. Stan and Eleanor—office romance—tolerable—(as the poster said), it's not likely they are going to be out in the field trying not to get each other killed. Plus, they are "settled", and not apt to have very much volatility in their relationship, and also now it goes on pretty much in the background.

Marshall and Mary are in life and death situations, they needs to stay focus on the job to be done and not be distracted by each other. And then, what about us? Since Mary and Marshall are most definitely "unsettled", are we going to be subjected each week to the Soapy-issues of a Marshall & Mary relationship? (I'd expect there to be many if these two hooked up). It is enough that Marshall has Mary's back—he needs to leave the rest of her alone.

I LOVE THIS SHOW. MARSHALL AND MARY ARE AWESOME, ALONG WITH THE PLOT! HOPE WE GET A FEW MORE SEASONS OUT OUT OF IT!

Agreed!

I am all for their relationship. I don't care if it's a cliche, because half the time everything is nowadays. As long as it's well written, it can work. As for the people that say they need to focus on their jobs so they don't get shot, remember what happened first season? They were fighting because Marshall was looking at other jobs (because he loves her and it hurts him to be around her) and Mary wasn't on top of her game while he was checking under the hood, and Marshall got shot. Their relationship already creates tension in which they can get shot because they're fighting. That's just how they are. But I doubt they'll start anything between them for a long while. I just hope she ditches Raph soon. Blech.

I'm in the no way camp. The surest way to ruin a show is involve the leads in a romantic relationship because it's what the fans want. If it's in the design for the series, like Michael and Fiona on BN, fine. It works. But when it's done because of a poll or fan mail/posts or anything like that, well, horrors! I can't think of an occasion when it worked.

I agree. They are already a bit more emotionally involved with each other because they are good friends in addition to being partners, so I don't see a whole lot changing in how they work together if something were to happen between them. And if anything does happen, I agree that it won't happen for a while.



I think it kinda always was in the design of the series - at least on Marshall's side. And since it hasn't been addressed head-on yet, that might indicate that it's something they are stretching out and saving for some time down the line. But I agree that no show should change course simply due to a fan response. It's better if they keep to their own vision of the series.

Hi!

I actually agree with you that they have to be really careful with that storyline, since it's a very potential shark jumper. But it feels like it's their entire plan, at least far in the future, for the series. I can see them developing it slowly, and hopefully well! Also, I get the being on the fence about G/E in CI, but the guy who plays Marshall has pretty clearly stated what his character feels, and I don't think they'd just leave that hanging there.

Oh c'mon. You've gotta ship somebody!

(PS- I definitely am cautious about shipping law enforcement partners in books and TV. I read this book 'In the Woods', a procedural, and it would've been great if the banter between the partners wasn't so cutesy and if they hadn't added the almost obligatory romantic development. In book ONE? Save something for further down the road, please!)

If Marshall is SO in love with Mary, what’s stopping him from declaring his affections? What is he trying to do—catch her between boyfriends? What? He thinks it will spoil their working relationship? He’s waiting for Mary to realize on her on that the she is ALSO in love with him? He waiting for her life to become unscrewed and her family issues to be resolved? By the time (if ever) any or all of these take place, they will be too old to do anything but look at each other. Exactly, what is the hold up here? Either you step up to the plate or move on. All that long term self-sacrificing suffering in the name of love is major BS. What is Marshal Marshall waiting for?

I think the true reason why nothing has happened is that the writers want to draw it out for a while.

But in the world of the show, I think he hasn't done anything because he doesn't know how Mary feels and if he makes a move and she isn't into it, it could really put a damper on their working relationship and friendship. Maybe he's resigned himself to the fact that nothing might ever happen, and we've seen him at least try to date other people.

in the world of T.V. shows, we all know it will happen. Whether it happens this season or not, is up to the ratings of the show and the writers. It's almost imminent that it will occur because that's the way t.v. series are nowadays. I personally wouldn't mind seeing it happen, it's not like it will ruin the show or anything. The ratings could go either way, if they end up together. I'd like to see them together personally, because i do enjoy the mushy love story fanasty type endings, although in real life it may not happen. They would be cute together for some time, but like i said, it all depends on the ratings, reviews and what the writers will do. No matter what happens it will still be a one of a kind fantastic show.

First off I'm totaly for M&M. Of course, the reason I think nothing is happening is the writer don't want to "ruin" the show by getting them involved too early/at all.

As for the story line though. Marshall knows he's exotic wild animal & knows what her responce would be if he were to do something. So he hides it with he's humor & come backs. He stayed in the Marshal service for her. Plus his blind panic when she was in the demolished building. He's totally in love.

She is too. She goes to him for support. Not Ralph. She just won't admit it. She's afraid to lose her best friend. Ralph is safe.

Sure...I ship Brenda and Fritz on The Closer! And of course, Elliot and Kathy on SVU.

And here...I know it's not the popular pairing, but I love Mary and Raph. I love that they are so different, that he always seems a bit bewildered by her, yet that he is obviously devoted to her. She is not very free and easy with her feelings, but I think she truly loves Raph and that he quietly and unobtrusively provides a peaceful, soothing center for her very complicated work and home life.

I know the ending of the “Jailbait” episode broke the hearts of a lot of folks in “Shipper Land”. But, if it isn’t meant to be, it isn’t meant to be. AND it wasn’t meant to be.

Actually Raph is too good for Mary, but she knows that already. I think she realized that this was a defining moment in the relationship and that she had to choose—no sane person is going to wait forever for another. I think she made the right choice.

Plus, Marshall and Mary are like bookends, yes they compliment each other, but there is a reason bookends are placed as they are. You put them together and they just don’t work.

Message to True Diehard Shippers—PLEASE STOP coming up with scenarios whereby Raph meets his demise.

Count me in the "Please, God, no" category. First of all, it's a tired cliche. Second, Mary and Marshall are so totally wrong for each other. He values intellectual pursuit. She mocks it and him for enjoying it. Seriously? They'd hate each other within a month. As much as I like Raph, I don't think Mary fits with him either. I'd like to see a Bobby D/Mary relationship. I think they are closer to equals than any other potential 'ship.

I hope the writers don't go there with Mary and Marshall. I honestly pick up no chemistry beyond really good friends which is nice. Michael and Fi are totally different in terms of chemistry - hot. I think it would be nice if M and M just remained great friends like Eliot and Oliva on SVU.

First off I would like to apologize to anyone who thought that I meant I'd like Ralph dead. I do not want him dead. I was trying to reference the stupidity of other shows.

As for those who think that M&M would never work because of there banter; I know some couple who are very similar in real life. They've been happy for years. It's kind of like their foreplay.

One great thing about last night episode we now know, In Plain Sight world, that there are no regs against WITSEC employees dating. Elenor kind of gave that away.

Are there any M&M shippers on this thread besides me? If so, did you like last nights episode as much as me. It gave me some hope that the writers are acknowledging the M&M subtext.

I don't have a problem with the banter. The banter is cute. The problem is she despises knowledge and he reveres it. That would be akin to a hardcore atheist and a devout believer or a vegan and a cattle rancher being together. Sorry, but it just isn't believable.

I agree with you about the banter - I've seen couples who behave similarly who are happy. And at this point in the game it's pretty clear that Marshall uses it to cover up deeper feelings. Time will tell if that's true on Mary's end as well.

I have no problem if these two got together somewhere down the line (and even with Marshall's all-but-confession during the toast last night, I still think it will be a while before anything happens. And while there is always that issue of partners getting involved and/or the cliche of male-female co-worker relationships ending in romance, I don't have have a problem with it here because these two have good chemistry and they've pretty much set up the idea since the beginning. Heck, in just the 4th episode in the series when Marshall got shot it was already obvious that he was in love with her.

Boy do we have a different interpretation of Mary. I don't think she despises knowledge. I think she likes giving him a hard time. Plus sometime his timing is not good, unless he's purposely tying to distract Mary?



Totally agree withabout Marshall covering his feelings.

As for them getting together soon.... Heaven forbid Mary doing anything people want from her. (Or writers for that matter )

Well, I think we all know how Marshall feels now, don't we? Did you not see the look on his face when he found out she was engaged. Of course it was hilarious that he had to go through the whole episode with her ring stuck on his finger. Then at the end he basically admits his true feelings, and no one but Mary got it. And she did get it. You could tell by the look on her face.

I don't like Raph. He just rubs me the wrong way. Bringing his mother there under false pretenses just to get his way was the straw that broke the camel's back.

And Brandy is so hot for him it's not even funny, and she's shallow enough to ditch a great guy for her sister's fiance.

Marshall is the only one that doesn't try to manipulate her. His intelligence and attitude is actually a compliment to hers. Opposites attract. She doesn't mock him, or despise knowledge, she just has a different way to show her intelligence. She's street smart, he's book smart. Together they are unstopable.

i think mary likes Marshall and thats whyMary put the ring in her pocket during that last episode anyone notice that? after the speech marshall gave mary put her ring in her pocket so case sovled they like each other i have seen it and so has everyone else that has seen this show from the start there was something odd about both of them and i knew there was something i wonder if they will consider making a 3rd season maybe more seasons????

I noticed the exact same thing! I also saw a little connection with Brandi and Raph, anyone? Right after their "talk" while she was "helping" him move.

And they're already in motion for a third season

Of course there's chemistry between Brandi and Raph -- they had a nice little subplot about that in season one, if you'll remember. Personally, I don't have a problem with Raph; just so long as he isn't with Mary, that is. Them being friends or even him and Brandi becoming a couple are both a-okay in my book. I don't necessarily want him written out of the show, but I can't say I'd be too horribly upset if he was.

As far as Mary and Marshall becoming a couple, I could definitely see that happening, but by no means could I see it being an immediate change. Maybe drag it out for 7 seasons, like Eric and Calleigh on CSI: Miami, or 5 like Lorelai and Luke from Gilmore Girls. Something slow, definitely, and a "long-time coming" sort of thing. I do see that Marshall likes her, that much is highly obvious, if you just pay attention to the show and the way he acts around her. Especially in the past few episodes, it's becoming increasingly clear, what with the engagement to Raphael.

Personally, I thought the same thing as Marshall did when Mary agreed to marry Raph. But I also thought it was setting them up for their break-up.

Marshall's behavior is a prime example of why non-shippers want to keep "partner-relationships" out of the law enforcement workplace. Marshall and Mary's relationship is screwing up Marshall even though they don't even have "a relationship".

First, he is snarling, acting infantile, and disrupting the office. Didn't you hear Eleanor? …if Stan were here, he would know how to handle this…(not a quote). Then in front of Bobby D he was harping on Mary's indiscretion of telling Raph about her job. That was very unprofessional on Marshall's part and had nothing to do with their assignment. Not only that, but there is the possibility that the lack of self-discipline he is exhibiting at this point could put the team at risk in a dangerous situation.

My admiration for Marshal is on the downswing. He is "misstepping" all over the place. I'm just saying—Marshall needs to handle WHATEVER is bothering him and "get his head back in the game". AND instead of sitting around analying Mary motives, maybe it's time for Marshall to start analyling Marshall's motives.

I think they are always going to let their personal interactions leak into their job because they are friends in addition to being partners, and they might get mad at each other from time to time.

Remember last season when Mary found out that Marshall was considering leaving and she gave him the cold shoulder in a very similar way, was snippy towards him while Stan was trying to give them the rundown on their assignment, and snapped at him in the prison while picking up the prisoner they were transferring (in front of that prisoner and guard and everyone else), and then they continued to argue in front of the prisoner on the drive? This isn't the first time something like this has happened between them, it's just the first time it's really come from Marshall. And when Mary was giving him the cold shoulder and acting unprofessional it wasn't because she had romantic feelings for him, it was because she was mad at her friend/partner for making a big decision that would have an effect on her without telling her about it first. Pretty similar situation, just the roles were reversed this time.

And even though he made things a bit uncomfortable in the office, it did not change his ability to do his job. He and Mary still worked together and got the job done. And again, Mary has behaved similarly and been disruptive, like when she was freaking out over Brandi getting arrested and basically accused Eleanor of being a spy for the FBI and said that terrible thing about her late husband.

I think part of what makes this show more interesting is that these people have relationships beyond just "co-workers." That leaks over into their professional life in bad ways (like when they are mad at each other) and in good ways (like the way everyone in the office dropped what they were doing to help Mary after Brandi got arrested). But overall, I think it makes the show far more compelling than it would be if we just watched them shuffle witnesses in and out and only treated each other professionally.

We're seeing human beings react in the full range of emotion. To me that's what makes the show so compelling. These characters are multi-dimensional -- as you said, not just shuffling witnesses, not just reacting one way. They are funny one second, deadly serious the next as the moment warrants.

I guess everyone sees what they want to see. In the looks exchanged at the end of the last episode, I saw Marshall knowing he's lost any chance with Mary, and Mary knowing she's broken Marshall's heart and feels for him (tears in her eyes, even). But she knew he never had a chance -- she knew their deep friendship, and love for each other, yes, was always going to be platonic. As I said in another post, I felt that her feelings about their partnership -- and what she yearns for in a different kind of partnership, a loving relationship different from the partnership with Marshall -- were both expressed beautifully in her monologue at the end of the "Rubble"episode. We all need different people for different emotional threads in our lives. Who can explain what separates one kind of love from another? I think she needs both Marshall and Raph in her life for different reasons. What will be interesting to see develop next season is whether Raph will be able to accept how dangerous her job is and stay in the relationship.

Meanwhile, Marshall's reaction to her having told Raph about her job is his way of expressing his anger at her having (in his mind) let someone else in on this thing that they shared. She's let someone else in on this intimate thing, and it's affected their bond. While to her, having let Raph in on this secret establishes another connection with him and strengthens the bond with him. (And I think the relationship with Raph is growing, in fits and starts, as she's evolving. She's trying. She's working at it, hard as it may be for her to give up what she's always known and allow for change -- and Raph recognizes her effort. It says a lot that she wants it to work, and she's trying. He's trying, too. How refreshing for a tv series not to have all the answers or fall into the convention of a couple being perfect for each other and never having to deal with different perceptions of life and reality.)

As for putting the ring in her pocket, it's where she kept it before, and by not putting it on her finger after receiving it from Marshall, it emphasizes that it's not from Marshall. That's my take on it, anyway. She couldn't have done it any other way.

I agree. Seeing characters that act like actual humans is very refreshing. Yes, it would be annoying if Marshall continued to be miffed for many more episodes down the line, but seeing him act angry and hurt for at least one episode just shows us how human he is. Marshall was hurt pretty badly. Not only was his identity as a Marshal for WITSEC broken, opening him to physical danger (which was a minor infraction), Mary also broke some of thier trust. Another part too, that I think hurt him, was that thier job was something that was kept between the two of them (well, as well as Stan and Elenor). Marshall thought that through all the boyfriends Mary would ever have, even if she got married, he would still be the only one to know about her job. But now that Raph knows, there is nothing that Marshall has over Raph. (and JEVAFSO, I'm rereading your post and seeing that you've already said all of this. I hope you don't mind me restating things...You make a very good point, and it makes me feel good that someone came to the same conclusion as I did)

Yes, their working relationship is a close one. They are friends as well as partners. When they become irate with each others, the lines are bounded to blur. And yes, Mary has been icy, as well as ignoring and snipping at Marshall in the past. But, with Mary (considering the things she carries), we take her semi-dyfuctionalism for granted. We've seen it more than once. However, the Marshall we have here, who is exhibiting these same "maladjustee" behaviors, is not the Marshall we've come to know, love, and respect. I'm not saying it was alright for Mary, but not for Marshall. I'm just saying that this Marshall Mann is not the "professional" who has been with us all along.

Even if he was peeved at Mary for telling Raph—that certainly didn't drive him to drink. AND even if all his other unbecoming conduct could be excused, Marshall was drunk (not drinking), but drunk (and at work). Inexcusable! Drunk = "unwilling" or "unable" to cope.

A couple of comments -- and I apologize that I don't know how to box the quotes from Jared D and Nauriel. (I'm maxing out my computer skills just posting my own thoughts.)

Comment #1: The Marshall we've known up to this point has been composed and professional, handling anything thrown his way with irony, humor, insight, logic, and intelligence (and mastry of minutiae). And that's made him a bit robotic in his stoicism, as well as charming and fun. But the engagement has thrown him for a loop, thrown him off his game if you will, and brought out another side of him that has been hidden behind the wall of professionalism -- perhaps because until now he's been uncomfortable expressing true emotions, or didn't know how. Now he's acting out -- and it shows he's human. He has to work through his feelings, and decide what he's going to be when he comes out on the other side. How many of us have had to rebuild our sense of self after losing love? And part of that is knowing where the object of that affection will fit in the New You.

Comment #2: As for getting drunk at work, these folks spend a lot of time in the office. Clearly he's closed up shop for the day and is not actually "at work/working", but maybe he's still there so he can squeeze out just a little more time with Mary. Maybe he doesn't want to go home because he'll be totally alone there. Maybe he feels more at home in the office than he does when he's actually at home. It would be interesting to see where and how he lives.

Comment #2: When Mary got truly icey with Marshall during "Horst", it was because he was breaking the bond of friendship and affection created by their working relationship by pursuing another job and leaving her. He may not admit it, but Marshall now sees Mary as having broken the bond by being intimate with another man by sharing their secret. Big difference. She's not leaving; she's not going anywhere physically, but emotionally, she's leaving him behind. As Nauriel noted, Stan and Eleanor also know what Mary and Marshall do, but as Eleanor once said about Mary and Marshall, "They haven't let me into their little club yet". So it's not a question of "knowing" but a question of intimacy -- with another man, I think. And that has brought out all these feelings he has for Mary that he couldn't express before or never thought he would have to express.

Comment #3: Seems to me that Marshall's had plenty of opportunity to tell Mary before about how he felt, but never did it. In part, I think, because he never saw her getting as seriously into a relationship as she has with Raph, and just thought they'd go on into the sunset without change.

Final comment: As much as I enjoy the Mary-Marshall banter and partnership, if I were in her shoes, I'd like to know Marshall has my back on the job but that I was going home to Raph.

Slowly we have been given some proof that Marshall is actually into Mary... Well, maybe not? Maybe?

I was always a little bit of Mary/Marshall after a few episodes into season 2, but it really didn't hit me that he liked her into "Lets Get It Ahn". Of course, the episode where he says "I love you". Probably like a sister... Mary is the only one that can understand Mary's stress at work... I mean, Marshall? Has totally got Mary's back on everything! Especially in the episode where she has to help the witness pinned on the roof...

Now we see that Marshall may have feelings more than we thought. He was crying so hard when Mary was rushed in... He also kissed her forehead!!!!!!!!! I was very happy and squealing. I don't have anything to say now, but I'm quite excited to see what's going to be happening!! (But sad, very sad Mary is doing bad...)

[color="#0000FF"][/color][font="Arial Black"][/font]It's pretty obvious Marshall is in love with Mary. I thought so when Mary was showing him her engagement ring. He's told her he loves her. But now he's definitely wearing his heart on his sleeve. He kissed her when she was on the gurney, he cried and he told Raphael that's how we are about people we love.

I didn't see any jealousy at all. I looked for it, but didn't see a drop. Even though he cried tonight for Mary, he still seemed great to her fiance', with no jealousy for him at all. I think he may love her, in his way (whatever way that is), but I don't see any attraction from him towards her at all, other than a partner loving another partner as a person. JMO, though I'd like to see some sparks, I don't yet...

Indeed - though, I suspect we may be seeing Raph's relationship change with Mary (based on the casting notes posted somewhere else on this forum).