Whenever Mary's lazy, boring mother or sister are featured, action stops. I realize they are included to show us a kinder, more loving side to Mary, but to put up with these freeloaders makes her seem like a patsy. It doesn't play as real.

If the show needs something to fill time, how about further developing Marshall, or their boss, the little guy who can really mombo!

That is correct...I didn't miss her at all...I think the only reason that her sister was there was for her to dress her up like a prositute and make Marshal pant!

Jacan: Hmm. It's an interesting point, and while I agree that the tone shifts when we have scenes in the home, I disagree on their function. Sure, they're there to show us another side of Mary - after all, they're the only two people Mary will admit to loving, and the only females she's got a chance to be close to.

I think they're there to take emotional journeys that will inform Mary's, as well as tell some truths about love and life that wouldn't otherwise fit into the other characters. And other stuff. Which is immaterial since it looks like the real complaint generally is that they're annoying.

Which is where I'm confused. Because I'm not seeing what most other people are seeing Is this the Izzie Stevens syndrome? (Another point of massive confusion for me, I've always quite liked her.) What makes Mary an unrealistic patsy for putting up with them? They're family. And I've known many situations where people put up with a lot more, just 'cuz they're friends. And assuming they are lazy and freeloaders, why does that make them bad characters? The boring part is more damning, but what makes them boring?

Personally I'm on the fence with her mum and sister, mainly because I'm a huge fan of episodic television, and this whole trend of slapping overlapping character-driven subplots into everything rarely makes me squee.

But in support of the writers, all that's happened so far is establishment of character. And if nothing else, they've succeeded in giving us two clearly defined characters. I actually find it quite charming that they're so similar in their weaknesses - I think we'll start seeing interesting comparisons and discussions as they each start developing in their own directions. But the fact that they haven't really started storylines yet means yea, they've been scenery.

Hi, BadAss.

I liked the part about the mother/sister emotional journeys informing Mary's. Let's hope these two get interesting enough to serve as cautionary tales, if nothing else. So far they are a yawn.

You are far more patient and loving than I if you would let a simple-minded, coke-snorting, unemplyed sister live with you. That aside, I guess I've been a Law and Order fan for so long I've gotten used to story lines that rarely include characters' personal lives.

Mary seems kind of similar to Grace, as in Saving Grace. Both are kinda, well....BadAsses! "Mistreat the guys" sorts. Hope the writers don't go too far in that direction.

I’m afraid I missed the Mom character. My first question when I saw Sis was “where is Mom? I’ve come to think of them as a set. Although Mom was not important to the story line, she is part of the household so her absence left me wondering. If there were a line regarding where she had gotten of to, I didn’t catch it.

Also, every time I see Sis, I think about her huge “C” stash. Wondering what she was into before she showed up at Mary’s door. Hope it isn’t too many more episodes before the Sis-stash issue is addressed. The show handlers certainly know how to use a carrot, don’t they?

Annoying characters must be written as annoying, otherwise, what’s the point. When it comes to Mom and Sis, is it that we are supposed to empathize with Mary’s and feel what she feels when dealing with these useless, draining adult wards? Was their relationship with Mary always as it is now? Another question to be answered down the road—I guess.

Mom and Sis don’t drag the show down for me, but it’s really hard to warm up to the characters because they are so self-absorbed and don’t seem to have any redeeming qualities. Silly, unaware and dependent is not endearing.

Loved the “hot/trashy” outfit Sis cooked-up for Mary—probably had streetwalkers shielding their eyes.

Heya Jacan-



Hehe, no, it's more like I've been on both sides of this particular coin enough that I can't help but see people in morally questionable places as interesting contextual gestalts. Whenever you tell the story, it tends to seem a lot worse morally though. But in real life...

The thing about Squish (can't remember her real name >_>) is that Mary doesn't know she's doing coke (and we don't know how much she's using) and she's really only been there for an extended visit, after probably years away. And it would be mean to disown family just 'cuz they're ditzy!

I hear you on the L&O - I'm more of a hard-core sci fi freak but it's essentially the same deal. TV's just gotten more complicated, so any runs of episodic or emotion-free tv are getting shorter and shorter :< Even L&O: CI's going all quasi mushy!



Hmm, it'll be fun to compare those two when Saving Grace comes back on. In part because I have no idea what they say about feminism today. I think I like it, and I think it's more progressive than Sex in the City. TV time!

Well, I haven't quite grasped the quote function yet. Anywho,

Hey JaredD



But they are Alive! And Brimming with Potential for Growth! Hehe. Perhaps we're seeing them through Mary's eyes, jaded and closed off as she is, and really they just have different values and a greater enjoyment of life.

You're point about it being hard to warm up to them is very good. At some point I've been rewatching episodes too many times and have gotten really drawn into the actresses performances. Which isn't what most viewers are doing. I'm sure the writers are planning on dealing with this by giving them relationships and things to do, but it would be unfortunate if the cloud of their introductions hangs over them and makes it hard to connect with them later on. :< I really hate it when you like half the cast, hate the other half, and have to figure out a way to watch half the episode and ignore the other half.

yes they need to address the "C" rthing.

Wow! Great discussion going on here, guys! I kind of like Mary's messed up family. I can see why she has committment issues. And why she would hesitate to invite any man to be a permanent part of her crazy family. I admit there are times I've been interested in someone and the thought has run through my mind, "How would he react to my family?" And my family is just loud and obnoxious--not self-absorbe leeches. I think the writers can get away with Mom and Sis being caricatures for a while, but sooner or later they have to give us something that proves they are human.

Am I the only one who absolutly loves Jinx? Seriously? She is made of awesome! Absolutly hilarious, the thing with the makeup sales was just fantastic. The sister I could live without, I don't think she really does much but on the other hand, seeing her hiding the drugs could turn out to be interesting. I think with someone like Mary and the way she is, I think it makes sense for her to have a wacky family so to speak. Well that's my 2 cents lol.

Thanks for putting it so succinctly. In my own wordy way, this is what I was trying to say. Still, I don’t think this week’s episode (4) came any closer to achieving this effect.

Really? How so? Because that's not how I saw it. Well, not exactly. I think Jinx hit rock bottom, in this ep, and what happens next will prove if she's making a turn around and start growing or not. Squish seems to be drifting down to a rebound point, though I think we'll have to give her a few more episodes to come into her own.

Didn’t miss Mom at all this episode. It was long after the episode was over and I was doing dishes that I realized Mom had been missing. (1) Was so taken aback by the fact that Ralph had come back and was already THERE when the episode started. (2) Very surprised there wasn’t any drama surrounding his homecoming (which I was looking forward to). (3) Got caught up in the Ralph/Sis play-by-play. So, I forgot all about Mom not being in the household.

We won't miss mom or sister. We hope the writers will stick with the story only being about witness protection and the duties/actions of Mary, Marshall, and the Marshall service. That makes it an interesting new series, NOT Mary's family which turns it into a soap opera. We don't care about a softer side of Mary. Tough is better!

I love Mary's family.
I find both actresses compelling, and I love the little side tours. I don't want the show just to be about case after case file, if I wanted that I would be watching something else. I want the whole enchilada. Give me everything that makes Mary tick!
BadAssJammieSquad I love your posts, I tend to agree with you a lot.
But in support of the writers, all that's happened so far is establishment of character. And if nothing else, they've succeeded in giving us two clearly defined characters. I actually find it quite charming that they're so similar in their weaknesses - I think we'll start seeing interesting comparisons and discussions as they each start developing in their own directions.
Just a beautiul observation.

After last night's episode, I have to say thank you to the writers for giving us this little morsel into the inner psyche of these women.
Abandonment issues, fear of the future , wow this sure can make for some crazy girls.

I look at my own family, and sometimes have to laugh, how hubby rolls his eyes when my sister calls, and he asks me what's going on in her land....cause she is living in her own little mind, and everything is a Shakespearean tragedy. I look at them and say, who in their right mind would associate with them.
We are not always like this, on Sundays we are on our best behaviour,mostly.

Designing Women's Dixie Carter has my alltime favorite quote how the South deals with this :"I'm saying this is the South. And we're proud of our crazy people. We don't hide them up in the attic. We bring 'em right down to the living room and show 'em off. See, Phyllis, no one in the South ever asks if you have crazy people in your family. They just ask what side they're on."

I love Mary, Mom and Sis!!!!

I agree. I love Mom and Sis.