As it is pointed out in previous threads about Shawn's uncanny lack of good decisions, last week (Till We Have Built Jerusalem) he made another bad decision as a 4400 political figure by:

-sleeping with a strange woman
-after he healed her parents
-while running a political campaign

I don't think I'll bother talking about how NOT a good ideal that was if Shawn wanted to keep a good image of himself in front of the public eye. So instead let's talk about what do you think will be Shawn's next bad idea?

If he ever got back with Isabelle that would be a very bad move.

I do know but Shawn does need to mature some.

Honestly, I think that it's not working with Jordan as a middle-man between him and the public. The political stuff is a game of the old-world. Jordan said it best when he said "Events are moving past that". Whatever good Shawn can do in a political campaign is TINY compared to what he could do working with Jordan. Maybe not in Promise city itself, but helping the cause.

Shawn to me is like the one guy yelling "EVERYBODY BE CALM" as he gets trampled by the paniced masses at a soccer game.

More like In "The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy" DON'T PANIC

HAHAHAH! Perfect!

heh well if i wanted to be evil i'd say

-sleeping with a strange man

;0 if you want to go into escalation that is

I hope Shawn hasn't forgotten his towel

Phanta, we sure are on the same page here!

scary huh?

I kind of feel sorry for Shawn. He gotten taken at that age where you're barely grown up. He got taken by PFTF and put back in a coma, woke with a very important ability, saw JC get shot, was put in charge of the 4400 center; I could go on...

Other than the obvious reasons, I can see similarities between him and Isabelle...growing up too quick. He's bound to make mistakes. How old is he anyway? 22 or so?

Kyle was in a coma. Shawn came back with an ability. He wasn't in a coma until last epi of season 3 and 1st epi of season 4

Thanks Phanta! That's what I meant to say.

see there meant to be together ,they have tons in common!!!!!!!!!!!!!ah sweet love!!!!!!!
ok ok rock ,elessar phanta dont worry u can tell me "i told u so" ;no no no they are bad for each other they are toxic ,britney&kevin toxic hi hi hi!!!!

A simple dignified "I told you so," after tomorrow's episode will make me very happy.

Shawn and Isabelle are SO PERFECT for each other!!!!!!!!!!!!

Baby, can’t you see
I’m calling
A guy like you
Should wear a warning
It’s dangerous
I’m fallin’

There’s no escape
I can’t hide
I need a hit
Baby, give me it
You’re dangerous
I’m lovin’ it

Too high
Can’t come down
Losing my head
Spinning ‘round and ‘round
Do you feel me now

With a taste of your lips
I’m on a ride
You’re toxic
I’m slipping under
With a taste of poison paradise
I’m addicted to you
Don’t you know that you’re toxic
And I love what you do
Don’t you know that you’re toxic

It’s getting late
To give it up
I took a sip
From my devil cup
Slowly
It’s taking over me

Too high
Can’t come down
It’s in the air
And it’s all around
Can you feel me now

With a taste of your lips
I’m on a ride
You’re toxic
I’m slipping under
With a taste of poison paradise
I’m addicted to you
Don’t you know that you’re toxic
And I love what you do
Don’t you know that you’re toxic

Don’t you know that you’re toxic

Taste of my lips and having fun

With a taste of your lips
I’m on a ride
You’re toxic
I’m slipping under
With a taste of poison paradise
I’m addicted to you
Don’t you know that you’re toxic
And I love what you do
Don’t you know that you’re toxic

With a taste of your lips
I’m on a ride
You’re toxic
I’m slipping under
With a taste of poison paradise
I’m addicted to you
Don’t you know that you’re toxic
And I love what you do
Don’t you know that you’re toxic

I’m intoxicated now
I think you’ll love it now
I think I’m ready now
I think I’m ready now
I’m intoxicated now
I think you’ll love it now
I think I’m ready now

now, Britney and Kevin seem to be working things out. He'd better not try anything with her kids! All Britney fans will be furious!

[quote name='Andrea18' date='Aug 4 2007, 07:43 PM' post='557016']
Shawn and Isabelle are SO PERFECT for each other!!!!!!!!!!!!

Don't fret Andrea. The writers are taking it slow this time. By the way, here's a link and an excerpt from a recent interview with Patrick/Shawn.


Popgurls interviews Patrick Flueger

Popgurls asked Patrick:

If you disappeared for a big block of time, what would be the first things you would do when you got back?

(laughs) Probably, have sex. Let's be honest with each other. That would probably be my first call. And then my brain only lets me get as far as the sex. I'm a young, 23-year-old male.

Typical. Men are pigs. Do any of you think of anything but sex?

I don't see how anyone can think that these 2 should be together. Shawn did not love her and said so. She admited what they had wasn't love. If I was with a guy and he told me he didn't love me. I'm done, Good-bye. NEXT.

I don't see how anyone can think Shawn and Isabelle should be together either, Phanta. See, something else we agree on!

Maybe I just dont understand or get "chemisty", but I dont see it between them. To me Shawn always looked "afraid" or "wary" of isabelle. And Isabelle was a selfish, uncaring, hateful, spoiled brat, that stomped her feet ( or killed people) when she didn't get what she wanted. If I was shawn I'd have ran away and never came back.

Shawn TRIED to leave Isabelle, Phanta, but she was too powerful and had too much control over him. He was terrified of her, never loved her, and couldn't get away from her. It was an awful relationship, and I never did see any chemistry between them either. I don't know if the actors themselves felt uncomfortable in the "love scenes" or if they just played it that way deliberately, but Isabelle seemed mechanical, like she was trying to remember pages out of the Kama Sutra, and Shawn just seemed bemused, like he wanted to get it over with and go to sleep. Well, that's how it looked to me, anyway.

I know i know in a replay of what happened with his brother... he will...


....seduce Cassie

... not sure how.. but with his track record...

really?!!! i'm not so sure about that,it depends if he's giving mix signals bad coordination between his mouth/his body language happpens a lot with guys!!!and young ladies have a hard time deciphering what he really wants so i'm not saying they should get married but together together yup!yup!
(dream a little dream with me...)
(sweet dreams are made of these'2' who am i to disagree)

Evenstar, I have often asked this question of Shawnabelle supporters. It's okay if you don't answer it-nobody has yet. Does it bother you at all, what Isabelle did to Shawn?

Not if it doesn't bother you what Shawn did to Izzy.
And some fans have answered you. Just not to your satisfaction.

Ay, you keep on keeping on. It's your opinion and others have theirs. Cuz opinions are like...well, you know what they're like...everybody has one.

i dont mind answering you, i'm just not sure if i'll be clear enough
yes it did bother me what she did to shawn,but in all fairness it also bothered me what shawn& richard&matthew did to isabelle, who had just loss her mom,i think if lily had been there isy would not have found herself in a situation where she behave the way she did,
coz her mother would have truly looked out for her unlike shawn &richard who both promise to look after her yeah right...
so somewhere down the road yeah shawn got what he was looking for , i felt sorry for him but i didnt think he was completely undeserving of it, i mean he tried to kill her she never did, she saved his life and what does she get not even a thank u he acts as if she's a leper, i really resented his reaction yet if she was willing to look past his flaws so was i,
as for the wedding if he was so adamant about not marrying her he didnt have too which he ended doing just that,so sorry if i dont buy into the whole he was so afraid of isabelle, he was not happy she was in charges of their personal life and pushing him in adirection he didnt want to (i get that he's young a lot more shagging to do!!) if issy was a normal person she'd get that that was not the best way to going about getting what she wants but she's not &she's not into the whole BS scenario a usual couple would go through,she knew what she wanted and went after it and YES THAT WAS WRONG OF HER..
she was so convince that her &shawn had to be coz he was the only one who could stop her from doing what she was destined to do kill4400 i bought into that as oppose to an overpowering passion AND IN ANY CASE THEY SO DO HAVE CHEMISTRY!!!! i believed their bond could get stronger,but once jordan came back shawn duck out (what a man!!!) first richard now jordan as an excuse ,i swear shawn is an immature kid just as much as isabelle, these two have really a lot to work out about each other and their self before they can really come together that's why i still keep hope coz on screen they mesh like no other(a touch of destiny about these two)remember end of season two when she appeared naked before shawn ,i mean of all people? like duh seasons to come stem from that first encounter...
lastly i believe that when isabelle goes into commando mode she loses touch with her human side richard matthew and shawn felt it bad of course she always feels bad afterwards(not matthew he was a nuisance good riddance) that's what happen with shawn in the interrogation room she was on a mission (like it or not) and had no time to dally with him but i love the exchange they had with baby baby baby words hilarious(totally i love u i love u not) no indifference there...i know this aint no soap-opera but let me say isabelle&shawn are like baby tigers compare to the things some soap-operas couples have done to each other and still can't seem to stay away from their toxic love!!!!
so that's that, u most likely dont agree but now u know where i come from wanting these two to make up and kiss already!!

Evenstar, thank you for answering me! I really appreciate it and I would like to address your points one at a time. I'd also like to say I'm glad what Isabelle did to Shawn bothers you-you're the first person to answer that question.



This I agree with. Lily's death was a terrible loss to Isabelle. Richard kept saying she wasn't really grown up, but talk is cheap and his actions were those of a man dealing with a grown woman. It's no wonder Isabelle didn't know what to think when her father was giving her such a mixed message. As for Shawn, he should have stuck with his determination to remain just friends. I don't think Isabelle would have been so possesive if Shawn had refused to sleep with her to begin with.



This I strongly disagree with. Isabelle did not love Shawn-she has admitted as much this season. Her behavior last year was typical of an abuser who wants to keep their victim close. As for Shawn trying to kill her, he was acting out of fear and in self-defense. There are many women in the real world who have killed abusive men in their sleep and gotten off scot-free, because people do recognize that if a person is terrified and unable to escape, they are entitled to use deadly force to protect themselves, even if they are not in danger of imminent harm. I also think a lot of the desire to Shawn and Isabelle getting back together is gender-based. I don't believe a man who treated a woman the way Isabelle treated Shawn would get this kind of support to get the woman back.



I'm glad to hear you recognize that Isabelle was wrong. I have to strongly disagree again about the wedding-you say Shawn was not afraid of Isabelle but that's just not true. Last year everybody but Jordan was afraid of Isabelle. Remember that she threatened Shawn's mother, and him and Richard both talked to her about how Shawn didn't love her and didn't want to marry her, and she just brushed them off. To say that Shawn was not happy because Isabelle was in charge of their personal life, in my opinion, is trivializing the issue. She wasn't picking out what shirt he should wear. She was threatening him, and he knew she had the power to back her threats up, and that she had already killed people and hurt her father. Certainly he was afraid of her and he was being forced into the wedding. And naturally Shawn would grab the chance to get away from this marriage that he did not want, to a woman he did not love. We'll have to agree to disagree about the chemistry-they had chemistry as friends, but I didn't see any chemistry as lovers. Isabelle was too driven and Shawn was too scared-it was an ugly relationship.



I didn't buy that for a second. To me, it was just one more indicator of Isabelle's emotional immaturity. Children expect others to keep them out of trouble. Adults keep themselves out of trouble. Children do what they are told. Adults do what they think is right for them. If Isabelle was too emotionally immature to decide what direction her life should take, she certainly shouldn't have been trying to latch onto someone else to do it for her.



I agree with you, and it's one more reason why they should not have been in a serious relationship.



And I hope the rest of this season, and if we get another season, next season, will stem from Isabelle's admission that she knows what they had was not love, and Shawn's response, no it wasn't.



I think you're right about this.



Oh, please don't say that! That was not a funny scene, or a touching scene. Isabelle was toying with Shawn like a cat with a mouse. He was finally standing up to her, even though he knew he was going to get hurt. That scene reminds me of every graphic rape scene I've ever seen on film, like a man with a knife to a woman's throat forcing her to say how much she likes what he's doing. It made me sick to see Isabelle in that scene, and I've been trying not to hold it against her, because I believe she is trying to reform now. That scene shows the depths of cruelty to which Isabelle can sink and I hope nothing like that ever happens again.



For which I am grateful. The soap opera route is strictly to titillate and amuse the viewers-the producers of the 4400 are trying to do something more realistic here. I hope they stick with realism, because realistically Shawn would never want to be in a relationship with Isabelle again. Well, I do appreciate your response, and I hope I've given you something to think about too.

wow, phanta. you are really out of line with this comment
Maybe you need a break from this forum perhaps?

Guess you forgot about Isabelle Reigns addressing this, and EasyMac, as well as others.
I do understand.

Let's see, you conceded that Izzy was "wrong" but you didn't get a response that Shawn was "wrong", only an excuse for his act of violence, in an attempt to justify it (or should I say "acts" because Shawn did use his powers on a school bully, and also Maia when NOVA had his mind buggin'). You know I agree, there is a double standard in effect here. But when a character is golden, that's usually how it works. That's why I just love the bad girl/good guy combination! Never a dull moment will be had with these two!
Plus, it's better than the gerbel I've been suggesting since last Season (perhaps Shawn just needs a pet to love)

not a break but yeah phanta it's not nice to say so!,and even though the same thought has cross my mind many times ,i dont cross the line of actually saying so coz i dont appreciate either when the same is said about women(woman r s.!) neither is true and both can be true individually.

anyway what i like about this forum is that even though we dont agree/or when we're goofing around it's lite there's nothin vulgar about the language we used which u can sometimes find popular on other sites(which in turns makes me wonder what age they are or what type of education they had if they can only resort to that type of communication when disagreeing) urrgh whatever.........

boooey, I don't think all men are like that. And I agree, that generalization is out of line and out of character for Phanta.
Hey Phanta? what's happening with some of your responses. You're scaring me.

Chewy

now chewy dont get confuse!! i never said izzy was wrong ,i said what she did was wrong that doesnt mean to say i think she was wrong the goal:yes the method:no
and me & rock have agreed to disagree,so i'm not bothered by what rock says ,i just respect his views! i dont mind trying to understand the other side point of view especially if i'm firm in mine so no risk of wavering ,nothing wrong with that and it's always easier to defend the good guy rather than the bad girl so i'm sticking behind izzy no matter what!!

That's a good point, Evenstar, but on the other hand, it's out of line to say Phanta needs a break from the forum. After all, that's an attack on Phanta herself, whereas she made her comment about a character on the show. To my mind, there is a difference between going after a figment of imagination, and attacking a real person. I know you didn't say that-I'm just making the point that sarcasm and attacking other people and mocking them is just as bad as using an inappropriate word, yet some people feel free to do that with posters they don't like. I think myself it's better to just ignore someone if you can't be decent.

Once again, I really do appreciate your kind and thoughtful response to my question. I don't know what will happen with Shawn and Isabelle, but I'm sure it will be interesting to see what the writers have in store!

I'm a gal, Evenstar! I would like to say I appreciate the respect you have shown to me-I think we've had a good exchange of ideas and now that each of us knows where the other stands, I am very happy to agree to disagree. And you're right-to say that Isabelle's actions were wrong is not the same as saying she, herself, is wrong. I think you did a good job of drawing that distinction.

You're right evenstar, you did say it bothered you and what she did was wrong. I do apologize!

Well you should know. Anyway, boooey did say "maybe", as in a suggestion, even ending it with a question mark. Phanta, please understand no one is attacking you. The world needs more stong minded women imo. Your posts reveal that you have an open personality and capacity to express yourself with humour. But the statement "men are" is all encompassing of fictional and real. If a statement similar to that were applied to females all heck would break out on this board. I'm just asking what's up.

lol i knew that rock, i got that from some other post discussion, but sometimes when ur writing it's not clear i mean rockingmule is not exactly the most defining feminine word out there, i'm a girl too...and me too i appreciate our exchange even though u break my heart lol!!lol!!

THANK YOU CHEWY! Now you know I am never on the boards on a Sunday but this had me jump on my computer to set it is straight but I see my beautiful pal Chewy has my back!

Hi Elessar,

Looks like I've already broken two of the three (hey, at least I'm honest about it LOL) so Phanta you're not alone.
At least you're among friends.

You know, I never really thought of a rockingmule as being either feminine or masculine, Evenstar. My name comes from an episode of Gunsmoke, where a deputy named Festus Haggen made a rocking mule (a mule version of a rocking horse) for three babies. So it always seemed like a child like name to me-Festus is my very most favorite character ever, and he had a very innocent and pure heart, like a child.

As for me breaking your heart, don't worry. One day you will come to appreciate my wisdom and agree that Shawn and Isabelle should only be friends, and then we will be of one mind and nobody will feel sad.

Let's just chill on the Isabelle bashing. You don't have to love her, like her but at least be fair. Both Isabelle and Shawn have made mistakes ( I use the term loosely because their mistakes involve super abiliites). Doesn't anyone get tired of the bickering? No, Shawn and Isabelle won't be married by the end of the season, they may not even get back together but as one who is entertained by the possibility, I think it should be explored.

You're welcome.

I'm watching my girl Lorena Ochoa smokin' all comers at the Women's British Open for her first major win on one channel, and Tiger Woods issue a golf smack down to Rory Sabatini on another. Plus tonight Shawnie and Izzy do they thang. Finally getting my money's worth outta cable!!

oh rock,i'm not saying i'm not tempted by ur wisdom but never for more than five seconds or mn at most,and u know what they say about hope:illogic ,not based on proof nothing tangible it's pure belief and it doesnt cost u a buck ,
so i'll hope u'll feel the same way someday about seeing the big picture about issy&shawn been a good narrative move on writers parts,in the end we can only rely on what they have to say about these two oh yeah and the producers final cut!!!lol!!

IsabelleReigns, that is a very unfair statement and the kind of thing that led to so much acrimony last year. It's not bashing Isabelle to point out her flaws, or to see her as a human being. Shawn has had his flaws pointed out a great deal and his shortcomings minutely examined on several different threads, but no one has accused you or anyone else of Shawn-bashing. I personally am not entertained by the possibility of a relationship between these two people, and I reckon I have the right to say so, especially when other people are exercising their right to say that they do like these two people as a couple. I feel it is hypocritical to talk about Golden Boy Shawnie and how badly he has behaved, then to complain when others say that Isabelle has behaved badly. You say to be fair-what is fair is when both sides get to state their opinions without unjust accusations of bashing a character.

Oh, I was just joking with you, Evenstar. Who knows what the producers will decide to do-we'll just have to wait and see what they present us with. It's really all up to them.

True, so true. You just left out YOU AND ME were right in the middle of it. IsabelleReigns wasn't into like we were/are.




Yeah, you've made that redundantly clear, but I haven't (and many others) asked you to stop. I like reading about what Shawnie thinks and feels, even it you aren't a show writer. It makes the character seem so real when you explain his "feelings" on sex and life and violence.




Respectfully, it's hypocritical to decry violence, then state Shawn had a reason for his but hammer Izzy about what she did to Shawnie.
Domestic violence is wrong no matter who inflicts it. That being said, it's the writers who chose to go the domestic violence route. Apparently in scifi its not illegal or unforgivable as violence seems to be a major part of this type of show. But I don't recall any posts that state anyone justified IZzy's violence against Shawn. However yours sure state Shawn had his "reasons". Okay, whatever you say cuz you're truly mad about the lad. Hope you enjoy tonight's eppy. I know I will cuz I wanna see Shawnie looking pretty in purple.