Full Version: Who Is Jordan Corlier
If he is a leader of 4400, why he hasn't a more powerful ability.
QUOTE (RyanSjet @ Jul 7 2007, 05:12 AM) 
If he is a leader of 4400, why he hasn't a more powerful ability.
I take it you are new to the show. I think he has arguably the most powerful ability this show has to offer. He can rebuke promicin induced abilites. Right now, Jordan has a small clique, there seems to be 2 seperate factions growing of 4400s, with Shawn at the helm of 1.
Jordan is a leader because of the fact that possess a leadership quality. I don't care who you are, if do not the leadership quality it will not matter your ability. Jordan was some "big" guy when he was taken and he had the "charm" and "charisma" to intice others to follow him. That is why I think he became the leader. (After all many leaders have had horrible ideas, and relied on the "abilities" of others to get things done.)
QUOTE (kitten0781 @ Jul 7 2007, 08:00 AM)
Jordan is a leader because of the fact that possess a leadership quality. I don't care who you are, if do not the leadership quality it will not matter your ability. Jordan was some "big" guy when he was taken and he had the "charm" and "charisma" to intice others to follow him. That is why I think he became the leader. (After all many leaders have had horrible ideas, and relied on the "abilities" of others to get things done.)
Hitler had great leadership abilities, and apparently charm and charisma too
QUOTE (Dobie @ Jul 7 2007, 09:34 AM)
Hitler had great leadership abilities, and apparently charm and charisma too
Yep, and that's why he was a leader. His own people voted him in.
Jordan Collier is a normal human being who has been through some extraordinary things. Before he was a 4400 he was a big businessman and he was very successful. He became the leader of the 4400's way before he showed his ability. His ability has nothing to do with his leadership skills-there have been charismatic leaders as long as there have been people and none of them needed promicin. It's unclear whether Jordan is a good guy or a bad guy. Imitar thinks the promicin distribution is going to cause a catastrophe, and I agree with him on that. I believe Jordan is a tragic hero-a term in literature that means a good man with a fatal flaw who causes a disaster and usually dies from it. Jordan's ability, like many other people's abilities, fits his personality. It's a passive ability-he probably can't hurt anyone with it, since people don't need promicin to survive. Except for the promicin distribution (we still don't know if that was the right thing to do or not) Jordan never hurt anybody, so it's in tune with his personality that he would develop a shield rather than a sword.
QUOTE (rockingmule @ Jul 7 2007, 09:25 AM)
Jordan Collier is a normal human being who has been through some extraordinary things. Before he was a 4400 he was a big businessman and he was very successful. He became the leader of the 4400's way before he showed his ability. His ability has nothing to do with his leadership skills-there have been charismatic leaders as long as there have been people and none of them needed promicin.
That is what I was trying to say. And for the person who brought up Hitler that is the main person I was talking about, but just did not want to bring him up lieterally. I did not want to make that comparision again. The Jordan/Hitler debate last took too much out of me.
QUOTE (kitten0781 @ Jul 7 2007, 10:36 AM)
That is what I was trying to say. And for the person who brought up Hitler that is the main person I was talking about, but just did not want to bring him up lieterally. I did not want to make that comparision again. The Jordan/Hitler debate last took too much out of me.
I understand
QUOTE (Dobie @ Jul 7 2007, 10:37 AM)
I understand
Thanks, and we must think alike or something.
Well, I don't really want to start the Jordan/Hitler debate again, but I don't like the comparison at all. Hitler's stated aim was to take over the world and kill all the Jews. Jordan's stated aim, and his private conversations and even his dreams confirm this, are to achieve world recognition by bringing peace to the world and make it a place where everybody is happy. Jordan may have gone about his dream in entirely the wrong way, but I seem to have read a time or two on this forum that intentions should count for something. Surely there is a huge difference between wanting to commit genocide, and wanting to bring peace to the world.
That is why I didn't want to start that debate, because I didn't know if I could compare Hitler to Jordan or not. (Sidenote: Didn't Hitler think that what he was doing was going to lead to world peace????)Just kidding, there is an argurement for everything and sometimes I like to play devil's advocate.
QUOTE (kitten0781 @ Jul 7 2007, 10:38 AM)
Thanks, and we must think alike or something.
We do.
yea.. the Hitler/Jordan comparison is not a good one.
Hitler was a cold blooded murderer of millions.
Jordan is not , and while promicen may kill thousands, they are not forced to take it.
There is a little difference between marching human beings into an oven to burn vs handing out promicen for people to take only if they so choose
Hitler was a cold blooded murderer of millions.
Jordan is not , and while promicen may kill thousands, they are not forced to take it.
There is a little difference between marching human beings into an oven to burn vs handing out promicen for people to take only if they so choose
Whether or not Jordan's actions will really save the future, Jordan doesn't seem evil. I don't think he's anything like Hitler: Jordan seems to honestly belive he's gonna make a change for the better.
Hi Bubba here, ...
That's what I get from the character also zippy.
QUOTE (zippylittlerat @ Jul 7 2007, 08:12 PM)
Jordan seems to honestly belive he's gonna make a change for the better.
That's what I get from the character also zippy.
QUOTE (zippylittlerat @ Jul 7 2007, 09:12 PM)
Whether or not Jordan's actions will really save the future, Jordan doesn't seem evil. I don't think he's anything like Hitler: Jordan seems to honestly belive he's gonna make a change for the better.
When I wanted to use Hitler as an example I was not saying that Jordan was evil. I was simply saying that both possess the required personaility traits to be a leader. Jordan being the leader has nothing to do with his ability, but his personaility. (I also am not how good Jordan's intentions are, or if he is evil. Right now I am not sure what to think.)
Hee hee sorry Kitten! I wasn't trying to attack or anything: I didn't even know who originated the Hitler reference, I just wanted to chime in! And I completely agree with Jordan and his ability. He has always had charisma. And I have no idea what to think of his intentions! He's an enigma.
And I completely agree with Jordan and his ability. He has always had charisma. And I have no idea what to think of his intentions! He's an enigma.
QUOTE (zippylittlerat @ Jul 7 2007, 09:27 PM)
Hee hee sorry Kitten! I wasn't trying to attack or anything: I didn't even know who originated the Hitler reference, I just wanted to chime in! And I completely agree with Jordan and his ability. He has always had charisma. And I have no idea what to think of his intentions! He's an enigma.
And I completely agree with Jordan and his ability. He has always had charisma. And I have no idea what to think of his intentions! He's an enigma.It is all good. I did not take it as an attack. I just got frustrated cuz I did not want to say Hitler's name, and someone else did and I found it funny. I think it is funny that when saying two people are leaders that some people think it is a direct comparison beween the two people, instead of a statement. (Not an attack on anyone, just an observation. I do it myself as well.) I saw that Hitler/Jodan kind of took off and I wanted to try to stop it.
I agree with not know what to think about his intentions. Sometimes they seem self centered and other times they really seem honest. Cofused.
It is all good. I did not take it as an attack. I just got frustrated cuz I did not want to say Hitler's name, and someone else did and I found it funny. I think it is funny that when saying two people are leaders that some people think it is a direct comparison beween the two people, instead of a statement. (Not an attack on anyone, just an observation. I do it myself as well.) I saw that Hitler/Jodan kind of took off and I wanted to try to stop it.
Yes, it's better not to bring up a name like Hitler, because unless you say a leader is the exact opposite of Hitler, there is an implication that you are comparing the leaders. I mean, you wouldn't say something like, "Abraham Lincoln and Adolf Hitler were both leaders of their countries," would you? It's a valid statement, but at the same time, coupling names implies similarities whether or not you actually mean any similarities between the leaders. It's hard at this point to compare Jordan to any leaders, because we don't know enough about how things are going to turn out. Leaders are not only judged by their intentions, but also by their results. Example-the last tsar of Russia, Nicholas II, is remembered as Nicholas the Bloody. Not because he was a cruel tyrant-he was actually a very kind man, a good husband and father, and quite mild-mannered. But because Nicholas was indecisive at a moment in history that called for firm action, Russia experienced a revolution and fell into Communism. Hence, Nicholas the Bloody, because for all his good intentions his country was destroyed and is only now recovering. Well, that's my history lesson for today.
Yes, it's better not to bring up a name like Hitler, because unless you say a leader is the exact opposite of Hitler, there is an implication that you are comparing the leaders. I mean, you wouldn't say something like, "Abraham Lincoln and Adolf Hitler were both leaders of their countries," would you? It's a valid statement, but at the same time, coupling names implies similarities whether or not you actually mean any similarities between the leaders. It's hard at this point to compare Jordan to any leaders, because we don't know enough about how things are going to turn out. Leaders are not only judged by their intentions, but also by their results. Example-the last tsar of Russia, Nicholas II, is remembered as Nicholas the Bloody. Not because he was a cruel tyrant-he was actually a very kind man, a good husband and father, and quite mild-mannered. But because Nicholas was indecisive at a moment in history that called for firm action, Russia experienced a revolution and fell into Communism. Hence, Nicholas the Bloody, because for all his good intentions his country was destroyed and is only now recovering. Well, that's my history lesson for today.
I tell you guys, I just can't wait to see what they make of him. It is so hard to have to wait a whole week for a new episode, I guess you could say I am addicted to the 4400.
I will be interested to see what Isabelle makes of the coded section of the prophecy book. Even if she says Jordan is a good guy and the PFTF are trying to use him for evil intentions, I won't be satisfied until Marco checks it out.
So what the future humans want to tell us is that the superman still need to be lead by a normal ppl,right?
Though one of the 4400 has the ability to control others brains,she still admits Jordan's leadership.
Human being is the real vip than the 4400, that's what i learned.
Though one of the 4400 has the ability to control others brains,she still admits Jordan's leadership.
Human being is the real vip than the 4400, that's what i learned.
I think you're right, Ryan. I don't like the PFTF who created the 4400-I think they're the bad guys and the people of the present, 4400s and normal humans, are the good guys.
QUOTE (rockingmule @ Jul 7 2007, 10:25 AM)
Jordan Collier is a normal human being who has been through some extraordinary things. Before he was a 4400 he was a big businessman and he was very successful. He became the leader of the 4400's way before he showed his ability. His ability has nothing to do with his leadership skills-there have been charismatic leaders as long as there have been people and none of them needed promicin. It's unclear whether Jordan is a good guy or a bad guy. Imitar thinks the promicin distribution is going to cause a catastrophe, and I agree with him on that. I believe Jordan is a tragic hero-a term in literature that means a good man with a fatal flaw who causes a disaster and usually dies from it. Jordan's ability, like many other people's abilities, fits his personality. It's a passive ability-he probably can't hurt anyone with it, since people don't need promicin to survive. Except for the promicin distribution (we still don't know if that was the right thing to do or not) Jordan never hurt anybody, so it's in tune with his personality that he would develop a shield rather than a sword.
You have such a way with words rockingmule. Off topic, I just got done downloading the entire season 3, and watched the gospel according to collier again, and when he confronted Isabelle at the end, she said, "If I'm supposed to be the enemy of the 4400, why don't I kill you right now?" And she had that angry, sadistic look on her mug like she so badly wanted to do something, and Jordan responded, "You're welcome to try, but it won't work, I'm prepared this time." It seems he was fully aware of his shielding ability at this point.
You have such a way with words rockingmule.
Thanks, Imitar!
Off topic, I just got done downloading the entire season 3, and watched the gospel according to collier again, and when he confronted Isabelle at the end, she said, "If I'm supposed to be the enemy of the 4400, why don't I kill you right now?" And she had that angry, sadistic look on her mug like she so badly wanted to do something, and Jordan responded, "You're welcome to try, but it won't work, I'm prepared this time." It seems he was fully aware of his shielding ability at this point.
Yes, indeed, I'm sure Jordan was fully aware of his ability and what he could do at this point. It was after seeing that scene that I put it together that Jordan could not have been bluffing, and it was just so logical that he had some kind of protection against the dear girl, and the simplest explanation was that he could affect 4400 abilities. I posted a message right away to that effect-it seemed to me that Isabelle launched an attack of some kind and it just bounced off Jordan. Like you said, she had that nasty look on her face, like she wanted to do some damage, and then it just drained away and she looked stunned, or confused...she definitely looked like things were not going her way. And then she went so quietly-that's completely in line with what Snowleopard has said about Isabelle's poor life skills. She literally had no problem-solving ability here. She had no idea how to cope with Jordan once he didn't go down, so she just had to leave. I mean, she didn't even try to SLAP him! She was completely stumped.
Thanks, Imitar!
Off topic, I just got done downloading the entire season 3, and watched the gospel according to collier again, and when he confronted Isabelle at the end, she said, "If I'm supposed to be the enemy of the 4400, why don't I kill you right now?" And she had that angry, sadistic look on her mug like she so badly wanted to do something, and Jordan responded, "You're welcome to try, but it won't work, I'm prepared this time." It seems he was fully aware of his shielding ability at this point.
Yes, indeed, I'm sure Jordan was fully aware of his ability and what he could do at this point. It was after seeing that scene that I put it together that Jordan could not have been bluffing, and it was just so logical that he had some kind of protection against the dear girl, and the simplest explanation was that he could affect 4400 abilities. I posted a message right away to that effect-it seemed to me that Isabelle launched an attack of some kind and it just bounced off Jordan. Like you said, she had that nasty look on her face, like she wanted to do some damage, and then it just drained away and she looked stunned, or confused...she definitely looked like things were not going her way. And then she went so quietly-that's completely in line with what Snowleopard has said about Isabelle's poor life skills. She literally had no problem-solving ability here. She had no idea how to cope with Jordan once he didn't go down, so she just had to leave. I mean, she didn't even try to SLAP him! She was completely stumped.
QUOTE (rockingmule @ Jul 8 2007, 12:55 PM)
<br /><font color="#0000FF"> You have such a way with words rockingmule. </font><br /><br />Thanks, Imitar!<br /><br /><font color="#0000FF"> Off topic, I just got done downloading the entire season 3, and watched the gospel according to collier again, and when he confronted Isabelle at the end, she said, "If I'm supposed to be the enemy of the 4400, why don't I kill you right now?" And she had that angry, sadistic look on her mug like she so badly wanted to do something, and Jordan responded, "You're welcome to try, <b>but it won't work</b>, I'm prepared this time." It seems he was fully aware of his shielding ability at this point.</font> <br /><br />Yes, indeed, I'm sure Jordan was fully aware of his ability and what he could do at this point. It was after seeing that scene that I put it together that Jordan could not have been bluffing, and it was just so logical that he had some kind of protection against the dear girl, and the simplest explanation was that he could affect 4400 abilities. I posted a message right away to that effect-it seemed to me that Isabelle launched an attack of some kind and it just bounced off Jordan. Like you said, she had that nasty look on her face, like she wanted to do some damage, and then it just drained away and she looked stunned, or confused...she definitely looked like things were not going her way. And then she went so quietly-that's completely in line with what Snowleopard has said about Isabelle's poor life skills. She literally had no problem-solving ability here. She had no idea how to cope with Jordan once he didn't go down, so she just had to leave. I mean, she didn't even try to SLAP him! She was completely stumped.<br /><br />
<br /><br /><br />Whatever Isabell is an evil or not, she is as same as the other 4400.Her ability comes from Promicon.Why the future human think she is the disaster? So i think that her promicon is different with others.Another explaination is that the promicon from the baby who is born by the one of the 4400 will chang.I mean the next generation of the 4400 will change ,they will become the monster with superior ability just like previous Isabell.
QUOTE (rockingmule @ Jul 8 2007, 12:55 PM)
<br /><font color="#0000FF"> You have such a way with words rockingmule. </font><br /><br />Thanks, Imitar!<br /><br /><font color="#0000FF"> Off topic, I just got done downloading the entire season 3, and watched the gospel according to collier again, and when he confronted Isabelle at the end, she said, "If I'm supposed to be the enemy of the 4400, why don't I kill you right now?" And she had that angry, sadistic look on her mug like she so badly wanted to do something, and Jordan responded, "You're welcome to try, <b>but it won't work</b>, I'm prepared this time." It seems he was fully aware of his shielding ability at this point.</font> <br /><br />Yes, indeed, I'm sure Jordan was fully aware of his ability and what he could do at this point. It was after seeing that scene that I put it together that Jordan could not have been bluffing, and it was just so logical that he had some kind of protection against the dear girl, and the simplest explanation was that he could affect 4400 abilities. I posted a message right away to that effect-it seemed to me that Isabelle launched an attack of some kind and it just bounced off Jordan. Like you said, she had that nasty look on her face, like she wanted to do some damage, and then it just drained away and she looked stunned, or confused...she definitely looked like things were not going her way. And then she went so quietly-that's completely in line with what Snowleopard has said about Isabelle's poor life skills. She literally had no problem-solving ability here. She had no idea how to cope with Jordan once he didn't go down, so she just had to leave. I mean, she didn't even try to SLAP him! She was completely stumped.<br /><br />
<br /><br /><br />Whatever Isabell is an evil or not, she is as same as the other 4400.Her ability comes from Promicon.Why the future human think she is the disaster? So i think that her promicon is different with others.Another explaination is that the promicon from the baby who is born by the one of the 4400 will change.I mean the next generation of the 4400 will change ,they will become the monster with superior ability just like previous Isabell.
QUOTE (rockingmule @ Jul 8 2007, 12:55 PM)
<br /><font color="#0000FF"> You have such a way with words rockingmule. </font><br /><br />Thanks, Imitar!<br /><br /><font color="#0000FF"> Off topic, I just got done downloading the entire season 3, and watched the gospel according to collier again, and when he confronted Isabelle at the end, she said, "If I'm supposed to be the enemy of the 4400, why don't I kill you right now?" And she had that angry, sadistic look on her mug like she so badly wanted to do something, and Jordan responded, "You're welcome to try, <b>but it won't work</b>, I'm prepared this time." It seems he was fully aware of his shielding ability at this point.</font> <br /><br />Yes, indeed, I'm sure Jordan was fully aware of his ability and what he could do at this point. It was after seeing that scene that I put it together that Jordan could not have been bluffing, and it was just so logical that he had some kind of protection against the dear girl, and the simplest explanation was that he could affect 4400 abilities. I posted a message right away to that effect-it seemed to me that Isabelle launched an attack of some kind and it just bounced off Jordan. Like you said, she had that nasty look on her face, like she wanted to do some damage, and then it just drained away and she looked stunned, or confused...she definitely looked like things were not going her way. And then she went so quietly-that's completely in line with what Snowleopard has said about Isabelle's poor life skills. She literally had no problem-solving ability here. She had no idea how to cope with Jordan once he didn't go down, so she just had to leave. I mean, she didn't even try to SLAP him! She was completely stumped.<br /><br />
<br /><br /><br />Whatever Isabell is an evil or not, she is as same as the other 4400.Her ability comes from Promicon.Why the future human think she is the disaster? So i think that her promicon is different with others.Another explaination is that the promicon from the baby who is born by the one of the 4400 will change.I mean the next generation of the 4400 will change ,they will become the monster with superior ability just like previous Isabell.
LOL. I agree. But Marco may not be able to decipher it. 
We may have to take what Isabelle says on faith, or at least assume that it's true because the writers say it's true, via Isabelle that is.
Elessar, if Isabelle says the coded sections are bad things about the PFTF who created the 4400, I might believe her, because that would be a statement against everything she has believed in up to this point. But I'd still be mighty skeptical.
We may have to take what Isabelle says on faith, or at least assume that it's true because the writers say it's true, via Isabelle that is. Elessar, if Isabelle says the coded sections are bad things about the PFTF who created the 4400, I might believe her, because that would be a statement against everything she has believed in up to this point. But I'd still be mighty skeptical.
I may be off base but I don't think Isabelle is going to share much about any information she stumbles upon unless it works into her agenda. I hope tonight we gain some insight into what Isabelle is all about now that she is out of prison.
Hey to you too, Elessar. 
That is so true...hmmm it has been a long time since I thought about the solution and actually forgot (at least we hope and looks to be the case). Yep...and Maia's diary states that Isabelle is going to solve the puzzle i.e. the code. Boy, I too hope tonight brings some answers but afraid we will have more questions.
That is so true...hmmm it has been a long time since I thought about the solution and actually forgot (at least we hope and looks to be the case).
Yep...and Maia's diary states that Isabelle is going to solve the puzzle i.e. the code. Boy, I too hope tonight brings some answers but afraid we will have more questions.
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